Beating that dead story warnings horse...

[scribblinlenore]

This is something that comes up every now and then for me personally, and now it's come up for fandom in general since it's summer and these issues always crop up when there's nothing to watch on the TeeVee.



I get why people want warnings. Fan fiction isn't like picking up a book off the shelf at the Barnes and Noble. I've really come to understand that. We all have pre-existing attachments to the characters, and that gives us sensitivities we don't have with original fiction, and I do truly believe that fan writers should do their best to put warnings on stories for things that are truly beyond the pale, like character death, rape, incest, bestiality, etc. Fandom is a community, and we should extend this courtesy. Or at least, I should say that *I'm* willing to extend that courtesy.

Still, I'm dismayed when I read "why can't writers put warnings on their stories" rants (I come across one pretty much every week, and want to make it clear that this is a general response, not specific to any one person) and there always seems to be an assumption that writers are being careless or purposefully trying to get people to read things they're not interested in. And never, EVER any recognition that people have different perspectives on things, that they have different values and cultures and life experiences, and therefore read things differently. That what to one person needs a stern warning is...not even a blip on the old radar to someone else. Stories don't always fit neatly into categories. If you feed John Sheppard to the Wraith, that's clearly character death. But what about a story where Rodney's body dies, but he continues to exist as a completely responsive and tangible holographic being? If Kolya rapes Rodney to get his command codes from him, that's plainly non-con. But what if John wants to have sex with Rodney but can't allow himself to do it because of DADT or his own internalized homophobia or...whatever, and he manipulates Rodney into "forcing" him? It's not always black and white.

I've gotten more than one outraged email from someone who was upset that I hadn't put a non-con warning on a story, and in each case, it honestly never, once occurred to me that there was non-con to be warned for. Didn't even OCCUR to me. That was simply not how I saw it, and I still don't, and I never will. Different people, different perspectives. No cure for that.

As much as I believe in extending courtesy, that will never change my conviction that a reader's comfort is ALWAYS her own responsibility. I know from my own personal experience that there are almost always hints and warnings of something that is going to happen in a story that's going to make me uncomfortable. If I continue reading anyway, that's on me. If I'm reading a story by someone who is such a bad writer that a gang rape is suddenly just going to fall out of the sky, then that's also on me. I should really know better.

Nobody promised anybody a rose garden around here. You seriously expect me to warn you for angst? For fluff? For an unhappy ending? Are you kidding me? As displeasing as it can be to read things you don't enjoy, you know what? You're gonna live.

Comments

[linaerys.livejournal.com]

Maybe it's just because it's a Friday, and I'm losing my mind, but this image:

"a gang rape is suddenly just going to fall out of the sky"

is cracking me up. Although my mental image is actually more like an orgy falling out of the sky, with limbs everywhere.

Ahem.

But yes, I take your point, and generally agree. I've had people email me and say that my story scarred them for life, and I'm all, well, it's about a sadomasochistic zombie and it's rated R; were you expecting fluffy bunnies? For some people you can't warn heavily enough, because they're going to wade in no matter what.

[vylit.livejournal.com]

I refuse to put warnings on stories. I know that makes some people rageblackout, but I hate seeing warnings on fic. I mean, I'll tell someone if there's a pairing, so they won't stumble onto incest accidentally, but I think that part of the beauty of reading a fic is not knowing where it'll go. I hate summaries and warnings that tell me what's going to happen. I want the story to unfold, and I want to discover it without being warned ahead of time.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

If it were an orgy falling out of the sky, it would be funny! *g*

I've had people email me that something I wrote gave them flashbacks to when they were raped, and I'm like: Sorry, you don't get to put that on me. I'm not a bad writer, and things don't fall out of the sky in my stories, and if someone doesn't stop reading when it becomes clear how things are going...well, that's their responsibility.

*aside* Are you sure you don't need anything for tonight? I'm happy to bring...whatever.

[linaerys.livejournal.com]

If there's some snack you'd like, you're welcome to bring that, but I'm pretty well-stocked. Thanks!

[onelittlesleep.livejournal.com]

I don't write many warnings on my fics because the story isn't just going to be about one character's death, or one plot point, but about a myriad of things that go hand in hand, or are like a passing stone, and I wouldn't want to just hilight one or draw attention to it, or make it more than it is. I don't want to warn, truthfully, because I don't want to spoil or set up an expectation. I think my stories are best unexplained, and a reader can get out of them what they will. If they find something about it disturbing, then they ought not to finish.

Yes, there is responsibility in writing, but there is an equal responsibility in reading. A reader needs to be shrewd and protect his/her own interest. The only readers I definitely feel should be protected from inappropriate material are the ones underage. Other than that, readers need to grow the fuck up.

Um, also. Yes, please. Where is this John fic where he coerces Rodney into fucking him??

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

I totally hear you, Vi. I've actually missed out on good stories because I paid too much attention to the pairings/warnings, and then heard from someone later that the story wasn't the way I imagined it was from what I'd read in the header.

I have sometimes considered adopting a "no warnings" policy, stating that in the header of every story, so people can take a chance or not. Because I do think part of the problem is that people get so dependent on warnings that they suspend their own judgment. "Well, it's titled 'The Hideous Gang Rape of Rodney' but there's no non-con warning, so I guess that must just be a metaphor or somthing, I'll go ahead and read it..."

The one thing I'm sure of is that someone is always going to be complaining, no matter what we do!

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

I know what you mean. It is hard reducing an entire narrative to a few categories. But I try not to think of warnings as a summary of the story. And, hey, if it keeps people from sending me "how dare you!" emails I'm all for it. I just wish people could be more aware that it's an art, not a science.

Where is this John fic where he coerces Rodney into fucking him??

Hee! Maybe someone will write it.

[beeej.livejournal.com]

I agree that whether or not to list warnings or even pairings and genre is completely at the discretion of the author, but I still appreciate it when they are there. I'm more likely to read their story if I have an idea of who and what it's about.

There is always a gray area, and the examples you've given wouldn't bother me at all if they weren't listed as warnings. But there are writers who post with nothing but the title, fandom, and rating. Hell, sometimes they don't even list the fandom. With so much fic being posted every day, I need a little more info if I'm going to invest time in reading something.

[lemonbella.livejournal.com]

The more people moan about the warnings thing, the less amenable I am to actually giving them.

It makes me despair of the comprehension ability of some readers as much as anything else. As you said, you can tell when something is building up (and therefore stop reading) and if you can't tell it's the kind of story you should be closing within the first paragraph.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

I totally hear you, and I think it's a perfectly valid, responsible readerly decision to say: I'm not going to invest time in stories that don't have a summary or warnings or anything that gives me a hint about it. I feel the same way!

But some people act like warnings should be a foolproof guarantee that they'll never read anything that disturbs them. And that's just...a seriously unreasonable expectation.

[improperlydone.livejournal.com]

I do not put warnings on stories and I will not do it either. Period. I hate doing summaries, and they're usually the first line of the story or a song lyric if I do put them. But I just don't do warnings. I usually don't write death fic either, but I routinely skip over stories that are labeled 'death fic'. Know why? Because you've given away what could have been a turning point in the story. Thanks for saving me the time to read it. I do appreciate that.

Why people are so 'sensitive' about angst I have no clue. (If someone warns me about angst, I know it's actually OOT melodrama and not angst.)

My take: Just read the damn story or don't. I will not take the blame if you're PMSing and you're upset that I don't have my characters running around in the clouds to make you happy. It's the Internet. You deal with it. If you're not adult enough, I suggest you disconnect and write you own damn fairytale.

And if someone is so gung ho for warnings, why don't people warn for crap fic or the fact that their characters don't remotely resemble anyone on the show they're writing about? You warn me of the men crying over hangnails and I'll warn you if they get angry and yell at one another, 'kay?

PMS made me write this, though I'd feel exactly the same otherwise.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

I feel that way sometimes, too. Like using warnings at all is giving a false impression that I'm somehow guaranteeing that no one will find anything objectionable in the story beyond what I've warned for. I've toyed with having a blanket "no warning" policy that I always mention in the header.

In the end, no matter what you do, there's always going to be someone who's unhappy!

[improperlydone.livejournal.com]

If you want to know what a story is about, isn't that more the purpose of the summary? Listing the fandom and pairing is something I'm all for purely for identification purposes. But I don't consider those to be warnings.

[carta.livejournal.com]

I am not a fan of warning for every little thing that might be in the story. I also don't like ratings, sixteen-line header notes, and a lot of what seems to be de rigeur in fanfic writing these days. I slide into Bitter Old Fandom Queen territory easily on this topic, but suffice it to say that until people start giving extremely OOC warnings, or "this story blows chunks" warnings, then I'm not going to take warnings seriously.

Besides, part of reading a story is the journey, and warning of non-con and such dilutes that journey for me.

[lemonbella.livejournal.com]

why don't people warn for crap fic

Absolutely! If I have to warn for someone having their tongue cut out, they should have to warn for piss poor characterisation and grown men behaving like teenaged girls. That's far more distressing.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

I hear ya. Warnings do often give away a story. Or worse sometimes, they distort my expectations. So I'm braced for something that turns out to be so very, very different, and that totally takes me out of the narrative.

Still, a lot of people use warnings, and I don't mind giving it the old college try. But when people confuse warnings for some kind of guarantee? Then I have a problem.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

but suffice it to say that until people start giving extremely OOC warnings, or "this story blows chunks" warnings, then I'm not going to take warnings seriously.

Hee! Of course, skimming the first paragraph is usually all the warning a gal needs for those things. And I agree. Warnings can really dilute the power of a story. I don't mind including them for the people who really want them. And the people who don't, can just ignore them. But it's annoying to me when warnings get confused with some kind of guarantee.

[beeej.livejournal.com]

No, I don't consider those to be warnings either, just normal header info. There are those who don't bother with those. And the summary is often the opening line from the fic, or a line of dialogue, and that doesn't help much, either.

What I was saying is, I appreciate the warnings as part of the identifying information, but that some writers don't bother with giving you any information upfront.

[beeej.livejournal.com]

There are no guarantees in life. But if someone wants to tell me ahead of time that I might fall into a big hole if I keep walking that direction, I appreciate it very much. :) If however, they think letting me fall into the hole will be much more exciting for me, well, I'm not really one for bitching and moaning. But I may never read them again.

[catmoran.livejournal.com]

Where is this John fic where he coerces Rodney into fucking him??

I've actually read that, and pretty recently, too. Although it was more manipulation, along the lines of a deliberate (on John's part) misunderstanding. Sorry, I don't remember anything else about it.

[scribblinlenore.livejournal.com]

*laughs* I should know by now there's no scenario I can dream up in SGA that *hasn't* already been written.

[jfc013.livejournal.com]

I routinely skip stories with "character death" warnings, and say I hate that kind of story, but I don't. If it's done effectively, I can enjoy reading just about anything. (Okay, except mpreg. Ick.)

I've even written some character death stories, but did I say it in the labels/notes? Hell, no! A lot of people think I write fluff, so if I'm specifically going to be non-fluffy, I put little "watch out--we're getting dark here" notes in the headers. That should be enough, and I've had no complaints, or none vehement enough that I remember them.

I do prefer rated stories, too, because I often don't have time to read anything rated softer than R! I'm a porn slut, and proud of it!

[medea-aries.livejournal.com]

I´m not a writer, but I don´t get why people just refuse to hit the back button. If at any point I see the thing´s not my cuppa, I stop reading.

Sides´, all authors have their style. You read RivkaT, you get Clark-Lex tango-ing mindfucks, you go over tizzy´s, and you get morally ambiguos Lex an apple pie-Clark, at fleshdress´ you get unusual parings. Once you see what a writter´s work is about, why would you click on expecting something different?

[catmoran.livejournal.com]

I'm wishy-washy about warnings.

For myself, I usually don't care if they're there or not, but sometimes I will stick to the comfort of heavy warnings. (Though even in the latter case, I'm happy to 'create' my own warnings by skimming the last few paragraphs!)

At the same time, sometimes I will suggest to an author that ze might consider warning for 'x', for future readers.

[catmoran.livejournal.com]

!!!You should have warned for your dislike of mpreg, you've just hurt my feelings!!!

[/silly]